Wooden lure bodies

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andypee
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Wooden lure bodies

Post by andypee » Sun Sep 08 2019 11:58

Hi all,

Would like to ask if anyone knows where I could get some wooden lure bodies produced ? I've tried making some myself which are ok but not identical as such, so when wanting to make another lure that is the same it needs to be re-weighted slightly and in a slightly different position, every time. Which does not give good consistent lure movement, or at least as near as could be if better produced.

I've noticed my process to be slow, so what I would like is some identical blanks making so that once one is weighted correctly I can produce more of the same lures and know how much weight is needed and where the holes go everytime!

Just have no idea who can & would produce these for me :shrug:

Any info would be much appreciated :thumbs:

Cheers guys
Andy.

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Re: Wooden lure bodies

Post by Steve Dennington » Sun Sep 08 2019 12:58

No matter how precise you are with replication, you'll always get variation in ballasting, even within a batch cut from the same piece of wood. If you're looking to churn lures out in large volume, with each one as close to identical to the last as possible, I'd look into resin moulding, but that too has its complications!

Routering wooden baits is much more consistent than hand shaping, so may be a good option for you, but if you want a more natural looking rounded profile hand shaping is the only way.

There aren't any shortcuts, which is why a lot of handmade baits are so expensive.

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Re: Wooden lure bodies

Post by MarkBerrisford » Sun Sep 08 2019 13:14

As Steve said differ er wood densities mean you never get them needing exactly the same weight, which is where mass produced wooden lures fall down.
You need to make templates and as Steve said a bench mounted router saves a lot of time, if your getting uniformity in the shape you can weigh the blanks which will give you an idea of how much lead to add, keep notes of blank weights and how deep to drill your holes, if your only making them for yourself a bit of extra time is no big deal
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Re: Wooden lure bodies

Post by andypee » Sun Sep 08 2019 14:21

Ahhh I see :thumbs:

The info you guys have supplied has given me a better idea of what's involved now, I suppose I just assumed that lure builders must have some quick and fast way of producing bodies, so they can make many lures act the exact same way!

Learning all the time :thumbs:

Andy.

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Re: Wooden lure bodies

Post by DaveGreenwood » Sun Sep 08 2019 17:23

andypee wrote:
Ahhh I see :thumbs:

The info you guys have supplied has given me a better idea of what's involved now, I suppose I just assumed that lure builders must have some quick and fast way of producing bodies, so they can make many lures act the exact same way!

Learning all the time :thumbs:

Andy.
As said wooden baits have to be individually weighted and tuned, no shortcuts but it's worth it.. :thumbs:

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Re: Wooden lure bodies

Post by Mike J » Mon Sep 09 2019 10:30

Andy,
The commercial manufacturers used to use a profile milling machine, probably the smaller producers still do.

There are better materials for lures than wood for the individual but the first question is how many do you plan to loose in a season?
If its only a couple its better to spend those dark winter night whittling by the fire.

(Using 100lb Ive only lost one in the past 5+ years)

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Re: Wooden lure bodies

Post by andypee » Mon Sep 09 2019 11:13

Mike J wrote:
Andy,
The commercial manufacturers used to use a profile milling machine, probably the smaller producers still do.

There are better materials for lures than wood for the individual but the first question is how many do you plan to loose in a season?
If its only a couple its better to spend those dark winter night whittling by the fire.

(Using 100lb Ive only lost one in the past 5+ years)

To be honest Mike the last lure I lost was many years back now, and that was on a cast after the link snapped & I watched a brand new first cast bulldawg fly off into the distance :laughs:

Don't get me wrong I really enjoy the making of the lures but I have very limited tools, jigsaw, sander & sandpaper, I just thought there maybe some wood turners that may be set up to repeat designs over and over, I really like the design side and painting, no idea if it would ever go anywhere other than a hobby, but who knows, never say never, if others can and all that :thumbs:

I'm not even 100% sure of the correct style files etc to purchase to create curved lure bodies etc.

I will need a lot more help & research :study:

Appreciate all your help :thumbs:

Andy.

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Re: Wooden lure bodies

Post by Chico 48 PAC » Mon Sep 09 2019 18:02

What sort of weight lures are you wanting?
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Re: Wooden lure bodies

Post by andypee » Mon Sep 09 2019 19:59

Chico 48 PAC wrote:
What sort of weight lures are you wanting?
To be honest I normally chuck lures up to 140g about, I'm really not sure exactly what weight I'm after as I'm not that far down the road yet.

At present I've cut some bodies out flat sided jerk bait style of about 8", I've got a few more steps to take before they can have a dip and be weighted, only then will I have an idea of what my home mades will take!

My actually favourite weight of lure is 120g, I'm not sure that kind of sized jerk bait will be taking anything like that though, as I don't want it straight down sinking :grin:

As you can see I'm only just learning :grin: really like the idea and find it interesting on how to make a good lure action by getting the weight correct.

I will be soaking up as much advice as I possibly can :study: long winter nights in front of the old log burner tuning my skills :laughs:

I really do appreciate all advice, help & suggestions :thumbs:

Andy.

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Re: Wooden lure bodies

Post by Mike J » Tue Sep 10 2019 13:50

If I was you Andy I wouldn't even consider using wood as a base material.
There are so many stronger materials that are easier to work than wood eg; the boards used in deck construction in boat building are so light an 18mm 3x3m sheet can be lifted with one hand yet take the weight of a man when support on just on its corners.

Have you checkedout the composite planking used to construct modern garden decking, more resilient than wood and certainly easier to work.
Because it comes in narrow planks it has to be glued together to produce something of realistic size which atleast stops all that drilling and poking around needed to install the through body wiring in a solid bodied lure.

I use building foam for float bodies, almost as soft as butter until its soaked in superglue, then you can stand on it without damage.

For shaping I would suggest you buy yourself a belt and disc sander like this https://www.machinemart.co.uk/p/scheppa ... nder-230v/
Think of it as an investment for your retirement :grin:

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Re: Wooden lure bodies

Post by andypee » Tue Sep 10 2019 14:42

Mike J wrote:
If I was you Andy I wouldn't even consider using wood as a base material.
There are so many stronger materials that are easier to work than wood eg; the boards used in deck construction in boat building are so light an 18mm 3x3m sheet can be lifted with one hand yet take the weight of a man when support on just on its corners.

Have you checkedout the composite planking used to construct modern garden decking, more resilient than wood and certainly easier to work.
Because it comes in narrow planks it has to be glued together to produce something of realistic size which atleast stops all that drilling and poking around needed to install the through body wiring in a solid bodied lure.

I use building foam for float bodies, almost as soft as butter until its soaked in superglue, then you can stand on it without damage.

For shaping I would suggest you buy yourself a belt and disc sander like this https://www.machinemart.co.uk/p/scheppa ... nder-230v/
Think of it as an investment for your retirement :grin:

:handshake:

Some good info there Mike much appreciated :thumbs: I had not considered what you suggested, I will deffo look into your suggestions :thumbs:

With regards to the wooden bodies, the videos I've been watching on lure making have not used wire through the wood, just screw in eyes with epoxy for holdings :shrug: am I missing something here ? I would like to get this right if I can !!

The only time I've actually seen wire used was when a wooden lure was cut in half then re epoxied together ?

Little confused now if I can go with the screw in eyes or not.

All interesting stuff to learn :study:

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Re: Wooden lure bodies

Post by Danoutdoors » Tue Sep 10 2019 14:58

I’ve made 2 attempts at lure building in the past, just couldn’t get in to it, all the tweaking and subtle changes and I soon lost interest, router table and templates with bearing cutters to get a exact shape every time but watch your fingers, there is safer ways if you can be bothered to make some jigs that hold the workpiece and run on a external template, plenty of stuff on YouTube 👍


8BBE50CA-6DA5-42C1-9F5D-74DF9C6D57C2.jpeg
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Re: Wooden lure bodies

Post by MarkBerrisford » Tue Sep 10 2019 16:50

Screw eyes are plenty strong enough unless your going to use balsa in which case you’d have to through wire
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Re: Wooden lure bodies

Post by andypee » Tue Sep 10 2019 20:18

Danoutdoors wrote:
I’ve made 2 attempts at lure building in the past, just couldn’t get in to it, all the tweaking and subtle changes and I soon lost interest, router table and templates with bearing cutters to get a exact shape every time but watch your fingers, there is safer ways if you can be bothered to make some jigs that hold the workpiece and run on a external template, plenty of stuff on YouTube 👍



8BBE50CA-6DA5-42C1-9F5D-74DF9C6D57C2.jpeg
Bottom lure looks good buddy :thumbs:

What did you find the hardest ? Getting the right glide action ?

The template jigs are an interesting idea will have a look into them :thumbs:

Andy.

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Re: Wooden lure bodies

Post by andypee » Tue Sep 10 2019 20:20

MarkBerrisford wrote:
Screw eyes are plenty strong enough unless your going to use balsa in which case you’d have to through wire
Thank God for that I thought I was in trouble there already :laughs:

That's my main concern a pike hitting the lure and the treble coming away from the lure, screw eye and all :grin:

Just be my luck that !

Andy.

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Re: Wooden lure bodies

Post by sebshelton » Tue Sep 10 2019 23:19

andypee wrote:
Chico 48 PAC wrote:
What sort of weight lures are you wanting?
To be honest I normally chuck lures up to 140g about, I'm really not sure exactly what weight I'm after as I'm not that far down the road yet.

At present I've cut some bodies out flat sided jerk bait style of about 8", I've got a few more steps to take before they can have a dip and be weighted, only then will I have an idea of what my home mades will take!

My actually favourite weight of lure is 120g, I'm not sure that kind of sized jerk bait will be taking anything like that though, as I don't want it straight down sinking :grin:

As you can see I'm only just learning :grin: really like the idea and find it interesting on how to make a good lure action by getting the weight correct.

I will be soaking up as much advice as I possibly can :study: long winter nights in front of the old log burner tuning my skills :laughs:

I really do appreciate all advice, help & suggestions :thumbs:

Andy.
Andy

I wouldn’t worry about trying to get your wooden lures identical. Each one being different is a positive. In the past I bought about two dozen Reef Hawgs.
None were the same, even after i’d “tuned” them, but all caught me pike. The same went for hand made wooden lures by well respected U.K. lure makers and ones I’d made myself.
As Mark said screw eyes are the way to go in all bar balsa. I was warned off gluing them by one lure maker though. He reckoned that this clogged up & lessened the effectiveness of the thread, weakening the grip rather than improving it. True or not I don’t know, but certainly none of the old school wooden musky lures had their screw eyes glued & they’ve accounted for some massive fish over the years.
Last edited by sebshelton on Tue Sep 10 2019 23:40, edited 2 times in total.

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Re: Wooden lure bodies

Post by Mike J » Tue Sep 10 2019 23:33

MarkBerrisford wrote:
Screw eyes are plenty strong enough unless your going to use balsa in which case you’d have to through wire


Sorry Mark, you may think a mass produced screw eye with its 5-6threads holding in 1/4" of wood is strong enough but from an engineering viewpoint I disagree.
A tiny screw thread in a wooden body csn never be the equal of a through wired system for anchoring hooks in lures intended for big pike.

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Re: Wooden lure bodies

Post by MarkBerrisford » Wed Sep 11 2019 06:19

I agree screw eyes are not as strong as through wiring but they are strong enough for pike fishing, I’ve made 100’s of lures and have never had an instance of a screw eye pulling out of the lure reported back to me
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Re: Wooden lure bodies

Post by andypee » Wed Sep 11 2019 06:50

sebshelton wrote:
andypee wrote:
Chico 48 PAC wrote:
What sort of weight lures are you wanting?
To be honest I normally chuck lures up to 140g about, I'm really not sure exactly what weight I'm after as I'm not that far down the road yet.

At present I've cut some bodies out flat sided jerk bait style of about 8", I've got a few more steps to take before they can have a dip and be weighted, only then will I have an idea of what my home mades will take!

My actually favourite weight of lure is 120g, I'm not sure that kind of sized jerk bait will be taking anything like that though, as I don't want it straight down sinking :grin:

As you can see I'm only just learning :grin: really like the idea and find it interesting on how to make a good lure action by getting the weight correct.

I will be soaking up as much advice as I possibly can :study: long winter nights in front of the old log burner tuning my skills :laughs:

I really do appreciate all advice, help & suggestions :thumbs:

Andy.
Andy

I wouldn’t worry about trying to get your wooden lures identical. Each one being different is a positive. In the past I bought about two dozen Reef Hawgs.
None were the same, even after i’d “tuned” them, but all caught me pike. The same went for hand made wooden lures by well respected U.K. lure makers and ones I’d made myself.
As Mark said screw eyes are the way to go in all bar balsa. I was warned off gluing them by one lure maker though. He reckoned that this clogged up & lessened the effectiveness of the thread, weakening the grip rather than improving it. True or not I don’t know, but certainly none of the old school wooden musky lures had their screw eyes glued & they’ve accounted for some massive fish over the years.
Yeah I deffo think I will have to calm my perfectionism side down :laughs: I can totally see your point with every lure acting a little different been a good thing, thinking on that is probably better and will keep it more interesting when changing from lure to lure, finding how to work each one best!

The not using epoxy on the eyes is an interesting thing for debate, i would be very interested to hear other lure makers views on this, funny I did watch one video last week and the guy never used epoxy on the screw eyes, at the time I thought it was a little odd, maybe not though :shrug:

Andy.

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Re: Wooden lure bodies

Post by andypee » Wed Sep 11 2019 06:55

Mike J wrote:
MarkBerrisford wrote:
Screw eyes are plenty strong enough unless your going to use balsa in which case you’d have to through wire


Sorry Mark, you may think a mass produced screw eye with its 5-6threads holding in 1/4" of wood is strong enough but from an engineering viewpoint I disagree.
A tiny screw thread in a wooden body csn never be the equal of a through wired system for anchoring hooks in lures intended for big pike.
I would agree Mike stronger for sure, would you always use the wire way if you were to make lures out of any type of wood, or just balsa as Mark stated earlier ?

Andy.

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Re: Wooden lure bodies

Post by andypee » Wed Sep 11 2019 06:56

MarkBerrisford wrote:
I agree screw eyes are not as strong as through wiring but they are strong enough for pike fishing, I’ve made 100’s of lures and have never had an instance of a screw eye pulling out of the lure reported back to me
Mark, do you use epoxy on the screw eyes then ? Interesting stuff all this :thumbs:

Andy.

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Re: Wooden lure bodies

Post by Mike J » Wed Sep 11 2019 08:48

Not balsa, actually I dont think I have ever used or owned a lure made of balsa.

Back in the late '60's the plastic 600sized Cisco Kids I was using were slowly degrading, hook 'hangers' aka screw eyes were coming loose and bodies were being punctured allowing water inside. My solution was Araldite epoxy, (there was only one product in those days).

I had been apprenticed to a company that produced aircraft fuel switches for the MOD, the tiny platinum contacts being held in position with thin 1/2mm strips of Araldite, these strips were produced by mixing the two parts then gently heating the mix before drawing it into thin fibres, allowing it to set then cutting to size, before reheating on final assembly.
Using this methodology I coated my best lures and secured the screw eyes in a manner impossible with the basic mix a smear system. Those lures are still catching today so I got something right.
I used Araldite on wooden lures with nail varnish remover as a thinner to obtain penetration, but it wasn't always successful.

These days there are some superb high tech strengtheners for wood, at the top end there are those applied by vacuum in the production of thin wood sheaths for high end fountain pens and jewellery, at the bottom a simple soak in epoxy resin.
But of all the materials available for todays lure anglers I think wood is down there with the flint axe.

Anyone who has examined the bodies of the Cralusso line of floats from Hungary or the hard body lures made by Westin of Denmark will quickly realise high density high strength foam is the future of lure bodies. We just need to learn how to use it.

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Re: Wooden lure bodies

Post by MarkBerrisford » Wed Sep 11 2019 12:35

andypee wrote:
MarkBerrisford wrote:
I agree screw eyes are not as strong as through wiring but they are strong enough for pike fishing, I’ve made 100’s of lures and have never had an instance of a screw eye pulling out of the lure reported back to me
Mark, do you use epoxy on the screw eyes then ? Interesting stuff all this :thumbs:

Andy.
I use a dab of gorilla glue on the eyes
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Re: Wooden lure bodies

Post by andypee » Wed Sep 11 2019 12:46

Mike J wrote:
Not balsa, actually I dont think I have ever used or owned a lure made of balsa.

Back in the late '60's the plastic 600sized Cisco Kids I was using were slowly degrading, hook 'hangers' aka screw eyes were coming loose and bodies were being punctured allowing water inside. My solution was Araldite epoxy, (there was only one product in those days).

I had been apprenticed to a company that produced aircraft fuel switches for the MOD, the tiny platinum contacts being held in position with thin 1/2mm strips of Araldite, these strips were produced by mixing the two parts then gently heating the mix before drawing it into thin fibres, allowing it to set then cutting to size, before reheating on final assembly.
Using this methodology I coated my best lures and secured the screw eyes in a manner impossible with the basic mix a smear system. Those lures are still catching today so I got something right.
I used Araldite on wooden lures with nail varnish remover as a thinner to obtain penetration, but it wasn't always successful.

These days there are some superb high tech strengtheners for wood, at the top end there are those applied by vacuumin the production of thin wood sheaths for high end fountain pens and jewellery, at the bottom a simple soak in epoxy resin.
But of all the materials available for todays lure anglers I think wood is down there with the flint axe.

Anyone who has examined the bodies of the Cralusso line of floats from Hungary or the hard body lures made by Westin of Denmark will quickly realise high density high strength foam is the future of lure bodies. We just need to learn how to use it.

:handshake:
Ahhh interesting that Mike, good reading :thumbs:

I've got one of the cralusso floats after you suggested them to me a good while back, it still sits in its packaging as I've not had chance to use it as yet, I will have a look at it more closely over the weekend :thumbs:

Andy.

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Re: Wooden lure bodies

Post by andypee » Wed Sep 11 2019 12:47

MarkBerrisford wrote:
andypee wrote:
MarkBerrisford wrote:
I agree screw eyes are not as strong as through wiring but they are strong enough for pike fishing, I’ve made 100’s of lures and have never had an instance of a screw eye pulling out of the lure reported back to me
Mark, do you use epoxy on the screw eyes then ? Interesting stuff all this :thumbs:

Andy.
I use a dab of gorilla glue on the eyes

Cheers Mark much appreciated buddy :thumbs:

Andy.

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Re: Wooden lure bodies

Post by MarkBerrisford » Wed Sep 11 2019 13:53

Other thing clean the screw eyes as oil left over from manufacture causes problems for glues, topcoats etc
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Re: Wooden lure bodies

Post by andypee » Thu Sep 12 2019 07:52

MarkBerrisford wrote:
Other thing clean the screw eyes as oil left over from manufacture causes problems for glues, topcoats etc
Nice one mark :thumbs: cheers buddy, I will give them a clean before use then.

Really looking forward to having a try!

Andy.

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