Hypocrits

[Andrew]

I read in the news there about a competition to remove catfish from a wee water because it's eating the ducks. But a cormorrant eating fish is ok.



It's true what they say if it isnt furry or feathered nobody cares.

[Nobby C]

If otters were hairless there would be less public affection.....

[Kev Berry]

Now is the chance to start flashing pics of otters chewing on the ducks

[Andytheammer]

Walt Disney has a lot to answer to!

[Kev Berry]

Walt Disney has a lot to answer to!

was talking to a friend of mine who lives next to a river. She was telling me how marvellous it was to have an otter coming onto her garden. I told her otters wernt cuddly and what otters will eat -----she was gobsmacked to find out they eat birds voles etc.
The general public only seem to know what Dysney has told them---something that needs addressing, don't hold your breath for the AT to tell the public a few home facts about otters.

[fergie68]

This one.?

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-essex-47759215

At least they didn't chap it.

[Neville Fickling]

I think the most important job for angling trust is to show otters in their true light . It will be mentioned to them!

[Kev Berry]

I think the most important job for angling trust is to show otters in their true light . It will be mentioned to them!

don't bother, I already have. they wont be doing ANYTHING about otters

[Jason Skilton]

The owners of the lake asked for its removal by the EA Fisheries team .......so the EA relocated it with the blessing of the Catfish Conservation group.....no harm no foul.....

Wel Catfish are still considered to be a invasive species in the UK....

[martin godliman]

I had a furious argument one day with a woman when launching my boat on the Thames, she was feeding the ducks and asked me conversationally what I fished for.

Pike mostly I said, she said " I hope you kill all you catch because they eat baby ducklings" no I said I put them all back pike and anyway they don't eat many ducklings they are purpose designed by nature to eat mostly fish since before the human race ever existed and the odd fluffy little duckling has to take it's chance like we all do.

She left muttering.

[Mike J]

The owners of the lake asked for its removal by the EA Fisheries team .......so the EA relocated it with the blessing of the Catfish Conservation group.....no harm no foul.....

Wel Catfish are still considered to be a invasive species in the UK....

Kev said 'I told her otters wernt cuddly and what otters will eat -----she was gobsmacked to find out they eat birds voles etc.'
Kev, If by your your statement you mean Water Voles can you please direct me to the scientific evidence supporting this claim.

The EA relocated a catfish?
Thats odd as they have a standing policy that all catfish (invasive species) must be killed unless its from a fishery that has a licenced stocking.
I know because I specifically asked for guidance when/if I caught one, their reply was if I didn't wish to kill it I should call them and would come and do it but under no curcumstances should it be returned as doing so was illegal.

[Jason Skilton]

The owners of the lake asked for its removal by the EA Fisheries team .......so the EA relocated it with the blessing of the Catfish Conservation group.....no harm no foul.....

Wel Catfish are still considered to be a invasive species in the UK....

Kev said 'I told her otters wernt cuddly and what otters will eat -----she was gobsmacked to find out they eat birds voles etc.'
Kev, If by your your statement you mean Water Voles can you please direct me to the scientific evidence supporting this claim.

The EA relocated a catfish?
Thats odd as they have a standing policy that all catfish (invasive species) must be killed unless its from a fishery that has a licenced stocking.
I know because I specifically asked for guidance when/if I caught one, their reply was if I didn't wish to kill it I should call them and would come and do it but under no curcumstances should it be returned as doing so was illegal.

Anglers cannot relocate as the don't have the necessary permissions to do so...EA Fisheries officer can do as they will haved assessed the new home to ensure that it is not connected to or near a river.

[Kev Berry]

The owners of the lake asked for its removal by the EA Fisheries team .......so the EA relocated it with the blessing of the Catfish Conservation group.....no harm no foul.....

Wel Catfish are still considered to be a invasive species in the UK....

Kev said 'I told her otters wernt cuddly and what otters will eat -----she was gobsmacked to find out they eat birds voles etc.'
Kev, If by your your statement you mean Water Voles can you please direct me to the scientific evidence supporting this claim.

The EA relocated a catfish?
Thats odd as they have a standing policy that all catfish (invasive species) must be killed unless its from a fishery that has a licenced stocking.
I know because I specifically asked for guidance when/if I caught one, their reply was if I didn't wish to kill it I should call them and would come and do it but under no curcumstances should it be returned as doing so was illegal.

you seriously need to ask for scientific evidence they eat water voles Mike? they will eat ANYTHING they can catch, the only protection from otters is they cant get down their holes like mink can

[alan behenna]

The owners of the lake asked for its removal by the EA Fisheries team .......so the EA relocated it with the blessing of the Catfish Conservation group.....no harm no foul.....

Wel Catfish are still considered to be a invasive species in the UK....

Kev said 'I told her otters wernt cuddly and what otters will eat -----she was gobsmacked to find out they eat birds voles etc.'
Kev, If by your your statement you mean Water Voles can you please direct me to the scientific evidence supporting this claim.

The EA relocated a catfish?
Thats odd as they have a standing policy that all catfish (invasive species) must be killed unless its from a fishery that has a licenced stocking.
I know because I specifically asked for guidance when/if I caught one, their reply was if I didn't wish to kill it I should call them and would come and do it but under no curcumstances should it be returned as doing so was illegal.

They don't eat Water Voles..........Seriously?

Nah, they don't eat the Voles that the Otters, Wells' or Mink don't, oh, and the Voles with a sign saying "don't eat me"!

[Nobby C]

Martin, you should have directed that lady to the clip of the heron with a squeaking fluffy duckling in its beak. That would have sent her into a self denial tailspin.

[Jason Skilton]

A study was undertaken https://www.sheffield.ac.uk/molecol/deb ... dotterdiet

It does support what Mike J is saying re Water Voles and not being on the Otter diet.....but there are very few recent studies being conducted on Otters diets.

[davelumb]

A study was undertaken https://www.sheffield.ac.uk/molecol/deb ... dotterdiet

It does support what Mike J is saying re Water Voles and not being on the Otter diet.....but there are very few recent studies being conducted on Otters diets.

Are there any water voles in the area covered by the study?

[alan behenna]

A study was undertaken https://www.sheffield.ac.uk/molecol/deb ... dotterdiet

It does support what Mike J is saying re Water Voles and not being on the Otter diet.....but there are very few recent studies being conducted on Otters diets.

And.......to be fair.........that to which you refer is only a Very Tiny Pilot Study........bit pointless to take as an isolated "stand alone".

All the main work is yet to take place, over a much longer period......so it's far too early to draw any conclusion in any direction, until the far more extensive works have been undertaken.........take into account that the Water Vole as a species has been absolutely devastated (now completely eradicated in some areas), by that walking disaster of the American Mink........and this former food source for many Predators has therefore been also all but eradicated from their present day diet. You ain't gona' find doodley' squat if a prey source is no longer present, so a survey would prove nothing.........you can't eat what ain't there.

[Jason Skilton]

A study was undertaken https://www.sheffield.ac.uk/molecol/deb ... dotterdiet

It does support what Mike J is saying re Water Voles and not being on the Otter diet.....but there are very few recent studies being conducted on Otters diets.

Are there any water voles in the area covered by the study?

No they have been eaten by the mink ;-)

[Kevin O'Keeffe]

The lake in question is quite a famous pike water that I think many of you will remember from the past.... See cover of mega pike!
Some prat seeded it with cats it seems... rumours of a cat fishing comp to get some more out after a news item on the local radio.

They did the same for pike many years ago when someone complained the pike nipped a kids toes and where taking ducklings! Got a few of us a days fishing on an otherwise closed water these days... Bloke drawn next to me was ledgering chicken chicks He blanked.
They wanted the smaller fish kept to remove to another local water.... the bloke who was running the "match" had a holding pen that somehow got a huge hole in it the night before the move... odd that! Said bloke seemed unsurprised Nice fella....

The owners are pandering to their customers.... restaurants all along the lake edge.... its too deep to electro fish and now the cats are settled unfortunately they wont be easy to get rid of now.

[Kevin O'Keeffe]

The lake in question is quite a famous pike water that I think many of you will remember from the past.... See cover of mega pike!
Some prat seeded it with cats it seems... rumours of a cat fishing comp to get some more out after a news item on the local radio.

They did the same for pike many years ago when someone complained the pike nipped a kids toes and where taking ducklings! Got a few of us a days fishing on an otherwise closed water these days... Bloke drawn next to me was ledgering chicken chicks He blanked.
They wanted the smaller fish kept to remove to another local water.... the bloke who was running the "match" had a holding pen that somehow got a huge hole in it the night before the move... odd that! Said bloke seemed unsurprised Nice fella....

The owners are pandering to their customers.... restaurants all along the lake edge.... its too deep to electro fish and now the cats are settled unfortunately they wont be easy to get rid of now.

[Kev Berry]

A study was undertaken https://www.sheffield.ac.uk/molecol/deb ... dotterdiet

It does support what Mike J is saying re Water Voles and not being on the Otter diet.....but there are very few recent studies being conducted on Otters diets.

Are there any water voles in the area covered by the study?

bet theres no elephants either If they not there how can you say they don't eat them

there are plenty of reports from wildlife trusts etc on tinternet about otters scoffing water voles

anyone who says otters don't eat them might like to give a reason why they think they don't.

[Mike J]

A study was undertaken https://www.sheffield.ac.uk/molecol/deb ... dotterdiet

It does support what Mike J is saying re Water Voles and not being on the Otter diet.....but there are very few recent studies being conducted on Otters diets.

Are there any water voles in the area covered by the study?

bet theres no elephants either If they not there how can you say they don't eat them

there are plenty of reports from wildlife trusts etc on tinternet about otters scoffing water voles

anyone who says otters don't eat them might like to give a reason why they think they don't.

Kev, et al.
If there are 'plenty of reports' can anyone please direct me to a single report or study that clearly states otters eat water voles?


Page 25, para 2, line 10 http://publications.naturalengland.org.uk/file/82038 Now isn't that interesting?

As we all know a predator will eat anything to keep body and soul together, we also know that given a choice it will always select its diet from a small number of preferred species.

[Kev Berry]

A study was undertaken https://www.sheffield.ac.uk/molecol/deb ... dotterdiet

It does support what Mike J is saying re Water Voles and not being on the Otter diet.....but there are very few recent studies being conducted on Otters diets.

Are there any water voles in the area covered by the study?

bet theres no elephants either If they not there how can you say they don't eat them

there are plenty of reports from wildlife trusts etc on tinternet about otters scoffing water voles

anyone who says otters don't eat them might like to give a reason why they think they don't.

Kev, et al.
If there are 'plenty of reports' can anyone please direct me to a single report or study that clearly states otters eat water voles?


Page 25, para 2, line 10 http://publications.naturalengland.org.uk/file/82038 Now isn't that interesting?

As we all know a predator will eat anything to keep body and soul together, we also know that given a choice it will always select its diet from a small number of preferred species.

so----otters will eat rodents, ducklings, cygnets, eggs, adult water birds and chicks of any kind, but will not eat water voles?. You having a larf Mike?
Just look up "do otters eat water voles" simples

I wonder why natural England want people to believe they don't eat water voles?

Concluding they don't eat water voles ----from a test in an area in an area that doesn't contain any

[Mike J]

A study was undertaken https://www.sheffield.ac.uk/molecol/deb ... dotterdiet

It does support what Mike J is saying re Water Voles and not being on the Otter diet.....but there are very few recent studies being conducted on Otters diets.

Are there any water voles in the area covered by the study?

bet theres no elephants either If they not there how can you say they don't eat them

there are plenty of reports from wildlife trusts etc on tinternet about otters scoffing water voles

anyone who says otters don't eat them might like to give a reason why they think they don't.

Kev, et al.
If there are 'plenty of reports' can anyone please direct me to a single report or study that clearly states otters eat water voles?


Page 25, para 2, line 10 http://publications.naturalengland.org.uk/file/82038 Now isn't that interesting?

As we all know a predator will eat anything to keep body and soul together, we also know that given a choice it will always select its diet from a small number of preferred species.

so----otters will eat rodents, ducklings, cygnets, eggs, adult water birds and chicks of any kind, but will not eat water voles?. You having a larf Mike?
Just look up "do otters eat water voles" simples

I wonder why natural England want people to believe they don't eat water voles?

Concluding they don't eat water voles ----from a test in an area in an area that doesn't contain any

Well, where is your evidence?


Or did a cable tug them away.

[alan behenna]

Mike:........I'll miss out your "et al"

You become Boring and Pedantic (yet again), time to do your projected self a favour.

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It is probable, therefore, that in much of the UK, only fish and frogs make a significant contribution to the diet of otters in freshwater habitats at present, the latter on a seasonal basis. In some areas, crayfish may become seasonally important as the otter population recovers, and there may be other, locally important, food sources in certain areas, such as mountain hares in upland rivers of Scotland (Conroy & Calder 2000).

======================================================================================================

During the winter, otter Lutra lutra were found to kill mountain hares Lepus timidus in the Scottish highlands. The possible method of killing is discussed. Hares and other mammals are an important part of otter' diet during winter.

========================================================================================================

What part of killing hares and other mammals don't you understand. IF that item on the food chain IS available in a given area Otter will kill and eat it. If that previously available food chain item has been wiped out in many areas (Water Voles by the curse of the American Mink) there can nowadays be no trace of that DNA in Otter spraint

=========================================================================================================

Go back to your "Flat Earth" society.

[Mike J]

Hi Alan,
Good to know you read the relevant sections.
I posted it for exactly the reasons your highlighting.

Mountain hares, who would have believed it?

[Kev Berry]

list of water vole preds
https://ptes.org/get-informed/facts-figures/water-vole/

anecdotal evidence otters eat voles
http://wildlifearticles.co.uk/return-of-the-water-vole/

when looking up what predates on water voles it would seem that EVERYTHING be it fish (pike) bird or mammal will eat them---the only exception in many lists of water vole preds seems to be the otter, how very strange. These lists say mustelids will eat them--then only mention stoats weasels and mink

so again I ask why do all the other mustelids eat them, foxes eat them, badgers eat them, cats eat them, in fact any other carnivorous animal or bird in uk---but otters (according to those who make a living from conserving otters wildlife) don't?

[davelumb]

Jason had it nailed. The reason otters don't eat water voles is the mink beat them to the buffet table.

[Kev Berry]

Jason had it nailed. The reason otters don't eat water voles is the mink beat them to the buffet table.

in that case shouldnt that read ----" The reason otters can't eat water voles is the mink beat them to the buffet table"