Leader Attachment

[Monts]

I got myself a Pike Fly outfit at the weekend, I've had some vouchers knocking about since last Christmas, so I thought I'd give it a whirl as it's cost me sweet FA. Now I was having a play about with leaders and how to attach them to the loop in the fly line.

YouTube is a boon for a novice fly angler like me. But most people suggested the 'Perfection Knot' as you can then loop to loop with your fly line and it aids swapping things about. But f**k me, the perfection knot had me semi ranting, I struggled with it.

Would a normal Palamor be OK? Or would the fly line, not get on with it?Or can anyone suggest another idiot proof knot.


Cheers.

[davelumb]

The Perfection Loop is a piece of p**s to tie.

This vid is a good demonstration of it.

[Monts]

My loops were fooking huge! I will have a look at that one when I'm home from work.

[davelumb]

My loops were fooking huge! I will have a look at that one when I'm home from work.

Takes a bit of practice to get small, even sized loops. But once you have the knack.

[Monts]

My loops were fooking huge! I will have a look at that one when I'm home from work.

Takes a bit of practice to get small, even sized loops. But once you have the knack.

Yeah, it's fine with string, but with thick mono, I was struggling to make a neat loop. I'll have to keep practising as the shop-bought Pike leaders incorporating wire are bloody expensive.

I need to be able to do this, this is a leader that came with the rod ect. It slips nicely alongside the fly line.

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[Mark_Houghton]

My loops were fooking huge! I will have a look at that one when I'm home from work.

The Rapala knot is a good one to easily get very small neat loops Jason....it`s pulled tight from the tag end, so easy to get the loop down to the size required then tighten it up without altering the loop size.

[lakefisher]

Here are all the knots anyone may need for fishing

https://www.netknots.com/fishing_knots

It actually doesn't matter what knot you use - so long as you end up with a stable loop on the end of your leader.

HTH ....... Tony

[Monts]

Mark/Tony.

Thank you both I'll have another play about tonight.

[Mike J]

I use a two turn water knot, its simple and strong.
The knot size is imaterial as it will be outside the tip ring so not interfere with casting and close enough to the loop in the butt end of the flyline as not to matter.

Buy a RIO 20lb saltwater leader, they are stiff and made of material that will lay a big fly out straight first shot. Cut the tip down until your happy with the length then attach your Wire Bite to the end with an Albright knot (loop on the wire).

if you've never chucked a budgie before, lay the line out on the bank, better still in a bucket and bomb it out first time.
If you find you want a line tray, and you will if you go more than once, comeback.

[Monts]

Rapala knot is easy, even for a ham fisted sod like me. Grabbed some line from home before I left for work and played about with it here. Nice one.

Mike,

Those leaders are a tenner a pop and I would not want to be cutting it about to get the required length, it makes no sense. I was thinking more about stiff mono, loop to loop with the fly line. And at the business end, my own traces similar to what I use for the majority of my lure fishing.

[lakefisher]

I personally use the figure of eight loop knot as seen in the link below - and attach the leader to flyline easily in this manner, push your flyline loop through the loop on the end of your leader - now pass the end of your leader through the flyline loop - pull this end until the knot of your leader loop reaches the flyline loop - gently ease it through - and then gently pull the two loops together - job done. I use (mainly) 6 feet of 27lb nylon followed by 18 inches of 40lb titanium wire as my bite proof business end then a fast change clip on the end of the titanium.
Here's the link...... https://www.anglingtimes.co.uk/advice/r ... -of-8-knot.

Glad to help ..... Tony

[Monts]

I personally use the figure of eight loop knot as seen in the link below - and attach the leader to flyline easily in this manner, push your flyline loop through the loop on the end of your leader - now pass the end of your leader through the flyline loop - pull this end until the knot of your leader loop reaches the flyline loop - gently ease it through - and then gently pull the two loops together - job done. I use (mainly) 6 feet of 27lb nylon followed by 18 inches of 40lb titanium wire as my bite proof business end then a fast change clip on the end of the titanium.
Here's the link...... https://www.anglingtimes.co.uk/advice/r ... -of-8-knot.

Glad to help ..... Tony

Tony,

Many thanks that kind of what I had in mind if one of my venues runs off enough by Saturday I'll go down and give it a bash.

[andrew_nagel]

I used the stuff Mike suggests - Rio hard mono in 20lb. About 5' + a 1' wire leader. I used to just tie the leader directly to the fly line's braided loop with a uni knot. The Rio stuff last ages and doesn't need changed often at all.

[dave aylett]

Surgeons loop
Really couldn’t be any easier.

[thueske]

I use a two turn water knot, its simple and strong.
The knot size is imaterial as it will be outside the tip ring so not interfere with casting and close enough to the loop in the butt end of the flyline as not to matter.

Buy a RIO 20lb saltwater leader, they are stiff and made of material that will lay a big fly out straight first shot. Cut the tip down until your happy with the length then attach your Wire Bite to the end with an Albright knot (loop on the wire).

if you've never chucked a budgie before, lay the line out on the bank, better still in a bucket and bomb it out first time.
If you find you want a line tray, and you will if you go more than once, comeback.

Mike, how important is the length, thickness, stifness etc of your leader? I am new to fly fishing (for pike) and I have no idea what to use as leader material.

[Monts]

My rivers were over the top at the weekend so I had a little play about in the back garden. The leader was five feet of 25LB Berkley Big Game, with a trace of about 16inches, made up of Fox Carbo Flex that I've had for some time. I managed a new PB bath towel that was a bugger to move from the washing line. Now the rivers are running off very well, it will be this weekend on the river. Looking forward to trying something new, I may crash and burn? I'm sure I'll get the hang of it over the course of time.

PS thanks for your input gents.

[andrew_nagel]

Length will probably have the greatest effect on casting. Too long and the fly will fail to 'turn over' - the fly will stall in the air and the line will not straighten out, reducing the distance of the cast. Too short a leader just risks spooking the fish with the fly line. A 5' length + 1.5' wire leader will be fine. The Rio hard mono is stiff - it just helps to stop the leader getting knots and tangles in it. Once you become proficient at casting you'll find you can get away with something less stiff like Amnesia mono.

This is the stuff. The label graphics might have changed by now as this is spool is likely 10 years old now.

IMG_3592.jpg

[Mike J]

I use a two turn water knot, its simple and strong.
The knot size is imaterial as it will be outside the tip ring so not interfere with casting and close enough to the loop in the butt end of the flyline as not to matter.

Buy a RIO 20lb saltwater leader, they are stiff and made of material that will lay a big fly out straight first shot. Cut the tip down until your happy with the length then attach your Wire Bite to the end with an Albright knot (loop on the wire).

if you've never chucked a budgie before, lay the line out on the bank, better still in a bucket and bomb it out first time.
If you find you want a line tray, and you will if you go more than once, comeback.

Mike, how imposrtant is the length, thickness, stifness etc of your leader? I am new to fly fishing (for pike) and I have no idea what to use as leader material.

We know Pike will often take immediately if your bait, lure or fly lands near them.
If the line between the hook and the rod isnt straight chances of a hook-up are at best minimal.
Rio Saltwater leaders are tapered, apx 40lb at the loop, tapering to the 20lb tippet. Because of their stiffness they are less lightly to land in anything but a straight line, an essential when casting into pockets or under overhangs.

A pile of soft loopy leader landing short with a big fly dumping on top is a quick way to ruin a holding spot and have a tangle to sort before you can cast again, somewhere else.

[MScustomflies]

For what it's worth here's my two penneth, any loop knot will do but a perfection loop is preffered as it stays open until clinched in a loop to loop whereas an overhand figure 8 or a water knot close up and the lines lay parallel. Use whatever you're comfortable tying and have confidence of being a strong knot.

I tie all my own pike leaders for fly fishing and I've always stayed to the same recipe for the last 10yrs minus the clip, I've tried several but used Mustad fastach for the last several years.
I take an arm span of 25-30lb fc, (mono will do but fc is stiffer) to one end I tie a perfection loop and make sure to moisten it and bed it down tight (fc doesn't always like perfection loops and this tends to be the weakest point should you get snagged). I then slide on a 1" piece of 2.4mm clear heat shrink, measure out 15" of single strand titanium (use 7 strand wire or whatever you prefer at this point in a length you feel happy with) form a loop in the wire and albright knot your fc leader material to it, moisten and work all the wraps tight with your nail whilst tightening down. Add another 1" piece of 3.2mm clear heat shrink tube and tie on a Sz2 or 3 Mustad fastach (Sz3 works best for hooks 3/0 and up, sz 2 works best with anything up to a 4/0) 3 turn blood knot the clip on and pull tight using the tag end. Place something through the clip and pull everything tight to the point of feeling the ti stretch a little. Clip all the tags and steam the heat shrink over the kettle and jobs done.

If your using 7strand/multi strand you can do away with a clip and tie your flies on using a jam knot should you so wish. For this tie an overhand knot in your wire 1/4" away from the end and pull tight with pliers. Know tie an overhand knot approx 1/2" above pull it closed a little but knot fully tight, put your fly of choice on between the 2 knots and pass the tag through the still open uper knot, pull it tight so the tag end knot is literally jammed and can't pull back through and away you go. Every time you change fly you lose a small length of wire that way though.

[Captain Ahab]

I have strength tested several different options and tried many ways, ultimately it’s personal but I now feel I have the optimum leader setup. I’m not casting in to tree pockets just relentlessly casting in to open water all day on Chew.... one arm span of 30lb flurocarbon with a small perfection loop tied each end. 2 ft of Rio wire bite 40lb with size 3 fastach at one end and large perfection loop at other to loop on to flurocarbon loop. 100% reliable simple and very easy to make. I check the wire bite after every fish and just quickly swap a new looped trace on if the wire needs replacing, I carry a wallet full of pre made ones. I have two other options, the first is for a delicate presentation I would loose the fastach and tie the fly directly to the wirebite using a small perfection loop to give maximum freedom of movement and natural presentation. If using a tube fly I just rig the fly with a big loop in the wirebite and then loop on off to the flurocarbon, takes seconds and is bulletproof. I have found the loop to loop connections fail at a much higher breaking strain than any knot connections and they are easy to change especially in a hurry or with cold wet fingers. The Rio wire bite is relatively expensive and I always wince when I buy a load but I think it’s perfect for fly fishing leaders due to its easy to knot ability and supper suppleness giving a natural presentation.

[Slug]

Perfection loop is easy keep practising. If I need small loops i hold the knot on the pad of my forefinger and use a blunt baiting needle to pass the loop through.

Keep your leaders short and stiff. I do use tapered polyleaders like in video below but also just use straight 45lb flouro

https://youtu.be/7DOy7ZjSDgY


Traces are coated 49 strand twist and melt to form loop. Fastach clip for non tube flies. Vision wire line is used in video below (6m30s on) but It’s difficult to get in UK and expensive.
Use this in 40lb instead. It’s pretty much identical and easy to get. If you fish chew I’m sure the lodge sells it slightly cheaper @£8.99?

https://www.fishingmegastore.com/wire/p ... 22101.html

1.2mm shrink tube off eBay https://rover.ebay.com/rover/0/0/0?mpre ... 1583903338

[nigel savage]

So many ways of leader set ups, personally I use a loop to loop fly line/leader connection consisting of approx four feet of 25lb Seaguar flouro carbon, using three turn "water" knot attached to approx four feet of 18lb Seaguar on floating lines, with approx six feet of 25lb on sinking lines when boat fishing.
A bit old school, but for the trace set up, it's a small barrel swivel in 12/14s, blood knotted either end, then knotted to approx 12" of Drennan "soft strand" 20lb breaking strain wire for reservoirs, and 15lb for rivers/drains, for fly connection I prefer a split ring, with this leader and lighter wire this set up gives me lots of fly mobility.

Just be aware if using heavy set ups 40lb leaders etc, hooking up in a snag could be disastrous, something has to give, with even the possibility of your fly line parting company!

Fly, and fly size, quite simply all flies catch fish,(Some more than others)To turn over a big fly that you see on the many clips/footage you will see that they use seriously strong stiff leaders to assist turn over of their flies, which in some cases up to 12" plus!! big is best? my fly size for Pike average 6/7" and are easily cast on the mentioned set up, and they have done me no harm over the years.

[Monts]

Gents,

Really appreciate the advice, owing to the conditions I've only had a couple of very short smash and grab sessions on the rivers these last few weeks. Nicked a couple of small Pike, but it was fun, and it's got me tuned in to getting a fly set up for general coarse fish.