(Vintage) Lure Porn

Talk about Lure/Tackle ID's; Reminisce over bygone times and old fishing tackle
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John Milford
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Re: (Vintage) Lure Porn

Post by John Milford » Mon Jun 11 2018 22:49

Of all the British plugs in my collection, these 'Roach' plugs are perhaps my favourite. I've yet to find any catalogue info on them, but I am as certain as I can be that they are Allcocks. I base this on the colour palette used on the red, blue and green ones, which is identical to the Allcocks 'Pike' plugs, even down to the distinctive orange eyes.

I believe there was a 'goldfish' pattern too, but I've only got red, blue and green - which are the colours usually found - plus a very scarce black one:

Image

This view shows the curious 'tube' construction (visible on the two on the left of the picture):

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You can see what I mean about the paint colours - exactly the same as the bottom two of these more conventional 1950's Allcocks 'Pike' plugs (the screw eyes and hooks are also the same):

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Re: (Vintage) Lure Porn

Post by Will Smith » Mon Jun 11 2018 23:13

This may be a dumb question John but, did the tube have a purpose ? Could it have been an alternative way of mounting them perhaps, or a reservoir for an attractant ? Or am I missing the 'bleedin obvious' here.
Clearly Allcocks did not stamp their name on all their gear then.
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Re: (Vintage) Lure Porn

Post by John Milford » Mon Jun 11 2018 23:25

The tube is something of a mystery Will. An alternative way of mounting the bait is a possibility (the original 'line-through' Roach?).

My bet is that it is there to strengthen the lure too. They are made of an extremely brittle plastic - possibly even celluloid. It may also have some bearing on the plug's action :shrug:

I might have to give one a swim . . . . ! :afraid: :laughs:
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Re: (Vintage) Lure Porn

Post by John Milford » Tue Jun 19 2018 19:05

Some of my early Heddons.
The first two have 'L Rig' hardware (used from 1914 to 1926). The others have two-piece or 'Flap Rig' hardware, used from 1936 until just after WW2.

Basser #8509:
Image

Baby Vamp #7400:
Image

Surface #210
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Flap Tail #7009
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Re: (Vintage) Lure Porn

Post by davelumb » Tue Jun 19 2018 19:07

:cool:

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Re: (Vintage) Lure Porn

Post by Mark_Houghton » Tue Jun 19 2018 20:47

John Milford wrote:
Some of my early Heddons.
The first two have 'L Rig' hardware (used from 1914 to 1926). The others have two-piece or 'Flap Rig' hardware, used from 1936 until just after WW2.

Basser #8509:
Image

Baby Vamp #7400:
Image

Surface #210
Image

Flap Tail #7009
Image
Love the glass eyes on baits from that era :thumbs:

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Re: (Vintage) Lure Porn

Post by John Milford » Mon Jun 25 2018 21:26

Everything is not always as it seems with some 'British' baits.

These lures are often referred to as 'Alnwick' spinners, as they were listed under that name in Hardy's catalogues from 1883 and sporadically until the end of the century. S.Allcock & Co carried them too as 'Quality No. 4431, types 1 & 2' (You can see why dealers prefer the 'posher' Hardy name!).

The truth however is that neither company manufactured them. They're actually American imports, made by Ernest F. Pflueger's Enterprise Manufacturing Company, founded in 1881. Pflueger's American versions included a luminous pattern - I'm almost pleased I've not got one of those, as they are probably still ridiculously radioactive!

The 'Alnwicks' from my collection:
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A photo (off the web) of a mint luminous Pflueger:
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The baits listed in Allcock's 1897 catalogue (top right):
Image
Last edited by John Milford on Sun Aug 26 2018 17:08, edited 4 times in total.
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Re: (Vintage) Lure Porn

Post by Mark_Houghton » Tue Jun 26 2018 10:20

John Milford wrote:
Everything is not always as it seems with some 'British' baits.

These lures are often referred to as 'Alnwick' spinners, as they were listed under that name in Hardy's catalogues from 1883 and sporadically until the end of the century. S.Allcock & Co carried them too as 'Quality No. 4431, types 1 & 2' (You can see why dealers prefer the 'posher' Hardy name!).

The truth however is that neither company manufactured them. They're actually American imports, made by Ernest F. Pflueger's Enterprise Manufacturing Company, founded in 1881. Pflueger's American versions included a luminous pattern - I'm almost pleased I've not got one of those, as they are probably still ridiculously radioactive!

Image

The baits listed in Allcock's 1897 catalogue (top right):
Image
Owners of such baits can be easily recognised by their feint glow as they walk off the venue at dusk :laughs: :laughs: :laughs: :laughs:

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Re: (Vintage) Lure Porn

Post by John Milford » Tue Jun 26 2018 11:35

Mark_Houghton wrote:
Owners of such baits can be easily recognised by their feint glow as they walk off the venue at dusk :laughs: :laughs: :laughs: :laughs:
:laughs: I try not to get too close to these old 1950's French baits . . . . . :eek:
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Re: (Vintage) Lure Porn

Post by Mark_Houghton » Tue Jun 26 2018 12:08

John Milford wrote:
Mark_Houghton wrote:
Owners of such baits can be easily recognised by their feint glow as they walk off the venue at dusk :laughs: :laughs: :laughs: :laughs:
:laughs: I try not to get too close to these old 1950's French baits . . . . . :eek:
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I`d be keeping those in a lead-lined tackle box :eek: :laughs: :dizzy:

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Re: (Vintage) Lure Porn

Post by hb904460 » Tue Jun 26 2018 18:13

Its interesting that in the 1880's tackle companies were in contact with their counterparts across the pond and deciding it was economically viable to import items.

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Re: (Vintage) Lure Porn

Post by John Milford » Wed Jun 27 2018 10:22

hb904460 wrote:
Its interesting that in the 1880's tackle companies were in contact with their counterparts across the pond and deciding it was economically viable to import items.
The tackle trade was not so different in the Victorian's days to modern times HB. Both the USA and Scandinavia had thriving lure-makers then, as they do now, and UK companies supplemented their domestic ranges with imports.

These lures were listed in Allcock's 1885 UK catalogue as 'Flat Metal Baits' (Nos. 100 & 1068) but they imported them from the Swedish maker Leidesdorff:

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Allcock's 1885 (top right):
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Leidesdorff from the same period:
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Re: (Vintage) Lure Porn

Post by John Milford » Fri Jun 29 2018 12:49

This bait isn't mine (I wish it was!). It is quite simply the most beautiful spoon I have ever seen. I bid £200 for it, but it sold for £320! :eek:
I've never seen another like it - I'm guessing late Victorian or early Edwardian from the 'art nouveau' look of it?

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Re: (Vintage) Lure Porn

Post by davelumb » Fri Jun 29 2018 13:04

John Milford wrote:
This bait isn't mine (I wish it was!). It is quite simply the most beautiful spoon I have ever seen. I bid £200 for it, but it sold for £320! :eek:
I've never seen another like it - I'm guessing late Victorian or early Edwardian from the 'art nouveau' look of it?

Image
Now, that is almost worth the price paid. Simply as an object. :thumbs:

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Re: (Vintage) Lure Porn

Post by John Milford » Fri Jun 29 2018 13:48

davelumb wrote:
John Milford wrote:
This bait isn't mine (I wish it was!). It is quite simply the most beautiful spoon I have ever seen. I bid £200 for it, but it sold for £320! :eek:
I've never seen another like it - I'm guessing late Victorian or early Edwardian from the 'art nouveau' look of it?

Image
Now, that is almost worth the price paid. Simply as an object. :thumbs:
What do you reckon on the design Dave? Art Nouveau or Arts and Crafts?

This is another fabulous spoon - actually two spoons, soldered together to form a three-dimensional body, with the tail giving the spin (again, one I missed out on :sad: ). More 'Arts and Crafts' in this case, I think? Not quite as expensive - this one fetched £160.

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Re: (Vintage) Lure Porn

Post by davelumb » Fri Jun 29 2018 14:38

John Milford wrote:
davelumb wrote:
John Milford wrote:
This bait isn't mine (I wish it was!). It is quite simply the most beautiful spoon I have ever seen. I bid £200 for it, but it sold for £320! :eek:
I've never seen another like it - I'm guessing late Victorian or early Edwardian from the 'art nouveau' look of it?

Image
Now, that is almost worth the price paid. Simply as an object. :thumbs:
What do you reckon on the design Dave? Art Nouveau or Arts and Crafts?

This is another fabulous spoon - actually two spoons, soldered together to form a three-dimensional body, with the tail giving the spin (again, one I missed out on :sad: ). More 'Arts and Crafts' in this case, I think? Not quite as expensive - this one fetched £160.

Image
I'd lean towards Art Nouveau. But it's not really my area of expertise.

The next one looks more Surrealist! :laughs:

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Re: (Vintage) Lure Porn

Post by John Milford » Fri Jun 29 2018 16:11

davelumb wrote:
John Milford wrote:
davelumb wrote:
John Milford wrote:
This bait isn't mine (I wish it was!). It is quite simply the most beautiful spoon I have ever seen. I bid £200 for it, but it sold for £320! :eek:
I've never seen another like it - I'm guessing late Victorian or early Edwardian from the 'art nouveau' look of it?

Image
Now, that is almost worth the price paid. Simply as an object. :thumbs:
What do you reckon on the design Dave? Art Nouveau or Arts and Crafts?

This is another fabulous spoon - actually two spoons, soldered together to form a three-dimensional body, with the tail giving the spin (again, one I missed out on :sad: ). More 'Arts and Crafts' in this case, I think? Not quite as expensive - this one fetched £160.

Image
I'd lean towards Art Nouveau. But it's not really my area of expertise.

The next one looks more Surrealist! :laughs:
:laughs: :thumbs:

All it needs is a couple of old clock cogs soldered onto it and it would be a 'Steampunkinseed'.

The only Art Nouveau lure I have in my collection is this modest little spinner. It works rather like a Colorado, but the spin comes from subtle little upturns in it's nice, sweeping lines. I've yet to find it catalogued anywhere, but I reckon it is of that period.

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Re: (Vintage) Lure Porn

Post by davelumb » Fri Jun 29 2018 16:19

'Steampunkinseed'.
:laughs:

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Re: (Vintage) Lure Porn

Post by Happy Hayes » Fri Jun 29 2018 17:41

John Milford wrote:
This bait isn't mine (I wish it was!). It is quite simply the most beautiful spoon I have ever seen. I bid £200 for it, but it sold for £320! :eek:
I've never seen another like it - I'm guessing late Victorian or early Edwardian from the 'art nouveau' look of it?

Image

How beautiful is that :thumbs:

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Re: (Vintage) Lure Porn

Post by John Milford » Mon Jul 02 2018 20:29

Some classic bar spinners that won't break the bank. They can still be found for sale occasionally in their original boxes, even though they date from the 1950's. The 'mother of pearl' ones are particularly nice and much trickier to find and were about three times as expensive as the metal ones in their day. Normark's version of the 'Vibro' spinner came slightly later but are very similar to the Horton Evans original patented design.

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"Slow cruising vibratory killer" (Ooh-err Missus! :laughs: )
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Re: (Vintage) Lure Porn

Post by Will Smith » Tue Jul 03 2018 20:01

I actually have a few of those myself John, really like your mother of pearl one :thumbs: , very nice.

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Re: (Vintage) Lure Porn

Post by John Milford » Wed Jul 04 2018 11:58

Mother of Pearl (or 'Abalone', as the Americans call it) makes a lovely blade for spinners and spoons Will :thumbs:

I've had this little kidney spoon in my collection for years, just because I liked it initially. After a bit of digging, I'm fairly certain it is another of Allcock's imports from Pflueger, circa 1900. The clevis mount for the blade is about the earliest I've seen - most spinners of this period usually had a simple loop soldered on the blade - not possible with M.O.P. of course, hence the clevis. I'm surprised it took another 30-odd years for the idea to be applied to metal blades.

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Re: (Vintage) Lure Porn

Post by Will Smith » Wed Jul 04 2018 19:38

I can see why you like it John, that is a particularly nice sample of MOP.
Non of mine shine like that, is there a trick to bringing the colour and shene out in them ?

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Re: (Vintage) Lure Porn

Post by John Milford » Wed Jul 04 2018 22:17

Will Smith wrote:
I can see why you like it John, that is a particularly nice sample of MOP.
Non of mine shine like that, is there a trick to bringing the colour and shene out in them ?

Will
That picture took a bit of composing to get the light to catch it just right, Will!

One of my tricks with grubby old lures is to use toothpaste or metal polish to bring the shine back to dull paintwork. That could work on MOP too? (I use very little and apply it very carefully!).

I don't use any kind of polish on my old metal baits though, as the 'patina' of age is something I like to preserve. I remove any obvious dirt or dust, but that's it.
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Re: (Vintage) Lure Porn

Post by Monts » Thu Jul 05 2018 14:22

John Milford wrote:
This bait isn't mine (I wish it was!). It is quite simply the most beautiful spoon I have ever seen. I bid £200 for it, but it sold for £320! :eek:
I've never seen another like it - I'm guessing late Victorian or early Edwardian from the 'art nouveau' look of it?

Image
I like that John. :thumbs:

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Re: (Vintage) Lure Porn

Post by Alex Fox » Thu Jul 05 2018 19:09

Great thread John ... cant help but catch up on here now and then to see what's been posted :thumbs:

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Re: (Vintage) Lure Porn

Post by Will Smith » Thu Jul 05 2018 19:53

John Milford wrote:
Will Smith wrote:
I can see why you like it John, that is a particularly nice sample of MOP.
Non of mine shine like that, is there a trick to bringing the colour and shene out in them ?

Will
That picture took a bit of composing to get the light to catch it just right, Will!

One of my tricks with grubby old lures is to use toothpaste or metal polish to bring the shine back to dull paintwork. That could work on MOP too? (I use very little and apply it very carefully!).

I don't use any kind of polish on my old metal baits though, as the 'patina' of age is something I like to preserve. I remove any obvious dirt or dust, but that's it.
I know I should not clean and polish them too much John and that they will possibly lose value if I do but, I have not been able to resist with some I have :laughs: , I take the hooks of first and the polishing wheel brings some of the old blades and bodies up a treat, the ones I have cleaned/polished I will use, and are not really intended for my collection.
I will try the toothpaste trick on my MOP blades and see how they come up.

Will.

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Re: (Vintage) Lure Porn

Post by John Milford » Fri Jul 06 2018 00:29

Will Smith wrote:
John Milford wrote:
Will Smith wrote:
I can see why you like it John, that is a particularly nice sample of MOP.
Non of mine shine like that, is there a trick to bringing the colour and shene out in them ?

Will
That picture took a bit of composing to get the light to catch it just right, Will!

One of my tricks with grubby old lures is to use toothpaste or metal polish to bring the shine back to dull paintwork. That could work on MOP too? (I use very little and apply it very carefully!).

I don't use any kind of polish on my old metal baits though, as the 'patina' of age is something I like to preserve. I remove any obvious dirt or dust, but that's it.
I know I should not clean and polish them too much John and that they will possibly lose value if I do but, I have not been able to resist with some I have :laughs: , I take the hooks of first and the polishing wheel brings some of the old blades and bodies up a treat, the ones I have cleaned/polished I will use, and are not really intended for my collection.
I will try the toothpaste trick on my MOP blades and see how they come up.

Will.
They'll be minty fresh! :laughs:
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Re: (Vintage) Lure Porn

Post by John Milford » Sat Jul 07 2018 13:54

As collectors like to say "They're all still out there" :pipe:

These are tiny (1 1/4") Heddon fly rod 'River Runtie Spooks', introduced in 1937.

The two on the right arrived in the post today. I spotted them lurking in a small batch of lures I got for just over £12. (Value isn't everything, but is an interesting reference point to a lure's rarity. The top-right 'Yellow Shore Minnow' is a pattern I've owned before. I sold my original one on eBay to an American collector who paid £45 for it.

(Welcome back to the collection little yellow 'Runtie' :grin: ).

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Re: (Vintage) Lure Porn

Post by Will Smith » Sat Jul 07 2018 22:37

They look as if they are having a job hanging onto their coat of paint John (some are quite wrinkly), is that just an age thing or do you reckon they have they been in next to something that have reacted to ?
Nice find :thumbs:

Will.

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